***** Post still being written – I will remove this line when its completed ******
Its apparent that there is a growing consensus in many circles – that Hmosexuality is not a problem but Homophobia is
Two bits of news today hight light this so I thought I would note those and give a bit of an overview on this.
The Dean of Washington's National Cathedral, Rev. Gary Hall, came out in no uncertain terms this weekend to denounce LGTB discrimination …. "We must now have the courage to take the final step and call homophobia and heterosexism what they are. They are sin. Homophobia is a sin.Heterosexism is a sin. Shaming people for whom they love is a sin,
Link here –> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/07/gary-hall-national-cathedral-homobia-is-a-sin_n_4057614.html?ref=topbar&utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false#sb=716653b=facebook
and the Anglican parish in Perth (Australia) votes to recognise same-sex relationships While the vote stops short of supporting gay marriage – and – we are yet to hear from the Archbishop of Perth, Roger Herft, who has 30 days to assent or dissent to the vote. The Anglican Father Chris Bedding says That from the last vote on this – the vote increased amongst both laity and clergy. So a lot of people changed their mind in a year.
As that Article notes
In July, that debate took a turn when Pope Francis made the comment that it's not his place to judge homosexuals. He also said gay people shouldn't be marginalised by society.
Link here –> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-07/anglican-parish-in-perth-votes-to-recognise-same/5003608
BUT in fact what do we know
The medical communities – Doctors, Psychologists,Psychiatrists etc all agree that Homosexuality is natural – is not an illness AND many have issued statements against conversion therapy even …. (in fact the evidence that it is harmful is so great that some locations have started to ban it)
When it comes to interpreting the bible one needs to spend some time on this matter….
There is a lot of debate about translations and on that debate – a lot of theology rests.
For example "was without form, and void,” in Genesis 1:2, should have been translated “became without form, and void.”
And this is Theologically very important. – Some Jews AND some christian churches believe in the latter translation – and the implication is that God wiped out an earlier creation. (Im saying either translation is right or wrong BTW)
My point is that there are even disputes over ther first chapter in the bible and how to translate it ….
And of course the term Christian – means "Like Christ" and so for the Christian community – the really important part of the bible should be the things Jesus said. His commands to us. They should supercede everything else.
So what does Jesus say that could bear on this topic…
Well – we know we are all Sinners
As Jesus said "let him who is without sin, cast the first stone"
and he also said (and note he says this in multiple ways – just to make it VERY clear what he is say – so there is NO room for misunderstanding – and there are no loopholes here either BTW – its funny how I often find people put in adjectives to try to make these verses NOT apply to them – but read it carefully
Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
There are no exceptions there. None. Zero. Zip. No one gets special dispensation from that command from Jesus the son of God who has also told us we are ALL sinners.
HOWEVER – – Jesus also says this
And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven
So even if Homosexuality Was a Sin (and Ill talk about that later) – anybody who stresses over other people being Gay any more than greed or arrogance or lust or envy or pride – IS committing a Sin – and they are disobeying Jesus too.
What DOES Jesus tell us – well the message of Jesus is hard. but its worth remembering that it was by obeying Jesus that the christians stood in the circus as they were killed (usually horribly) as a witness to christ – AND in doing so – they overcame the Roman Empire. BUT its actually not the message many people make up … this is the message Jesus gave us
Blessed are the meek for they will inherit the earth.
Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.
Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called children of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven
and theres more ….
I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42 Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
BUT lets NOT FORGET he does talk about people burning in eternal fire – but its not people who commit sexual immorality. (and look at this speech by Jesus and then look at the verses and then look at the actual sins of Sodom and you will see a STRONG overlap – a lack of compassion and care for the poor and needy and sick and homeless) …. Jesus himself says !
Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
Now compare that to what Ezekial says the sins of Sodom were
Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me
Notice a strong similarirty there – not looking after the poor and needy and punishment by fire ????
< More to come – check back later >
to do . Clobber verses