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iplantolive
 
Joined in 2008
August 5, 2009, 19:54

I think I need to watch more television……I dont know what you guys are talking about.


CSI stands for Crime Scene Investigation. It’s a typical American crime drama that is set in several USA cities … not my cup of tea really 😉


Hi Ash, welcome to Freedom2b[e] 😀



gettingthere
 
Joined in 2008
August 5, 2009, 21:21

One question I have is what exactly qualifies as pornography. I for one must admit that I enjoy looking at pictures of attractive men, usually not totally exposed and usually not engaged in any sexual activity. It is certainly a far cry from the degradation of women, rather it is more akin to a celebration of the male form than anything else. Is it really that bad? I know I’m probably trying to find an excuse for my own behavior, but I just want to hear what others have to say. I do feel somewhat guilty about this, but I wonder if this guilt might be misplaced. And besides, this is quite an interesting topic.



iplantolive
 
Joined in 2008
August 6, 2009, 20:12

One question I have is what exactly qualifies as pornography.


A valid question nonetheless. What might qualify as porn to one person might not be considered as porn by another. As mentioned in the thread on masturbation, do we have to apply a “black and white” approach to this? My answer would probably be no, because as with most things, we have a choice to consume it, or not to – it’s up to us. I guess the disclaimer here would be if it affects other people close to us, then we need to carefully weigh up our decisions and understand the possible impacts … just my thoughts 😉



forwardtherapy
 
Joined in 2009
August 6, 2009, 22:10

Another aspect that I have been thinking about recently is the viewer’s relationship to the people in the images.


The most obvious example is child pornography. We know that it is exploitation and abuse and the current legal framework takes the position that someone viewing child pornography is part of the network of exploitation and abuse.


But how often does someone viewing adult pornography consider their relationship to the people in the images? The viewer probably has never met these people, but has a relationship to them on the basis of being part of the market for them. One argument is that the individuals in porn films and pictures are actors or consenting adults… but can we ever know how ‘freely’ they made their decision to be in the images? For example, was the decision driven by drug addiction or medical needs (funding access to treatment)? Or by the poverty of their families?


How does our experience of viewing porn differ when we start considering the possible stories beyond the intention of the director or photographer?


As a slight aside, I knew a young (gay) guy who was studying at university and wanted to prove to his classmates that pornography was not always degrading to the actors and that these actors could be making a ‘free choice’ to participate and get paid. So he applied to be in a porn film and was accepted. He was so excited (more so about proving his feminist classmates wrong I think) but during the shoot he felt he had to go ahead with situations where he was not comfortable- he felt he had to go ahead because he was being paid. Afterwards he felt terrible and totally regretted doing it. I think he even used the expression ‘degraded’.


This is by no means to suggest that all porn actors feel this way as my understanding is many are very happy in their work. I guess I am just drawing attention to the idea that the consumption of porn does not just impact us or those close to us, but can have farther reaching consequences.



Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
August 7, 2009, 12:16

……and if I went to a sauna…….how would i feel about myself when I came out?


Do I feel good about myself?

Do I feel devalued?

Have I demonstrated self respect and respect for others?


i think self awareness is good in these areas…..if we are doing things that don’t make us feel good about ourselves and others then possibly we need to change the behaviours.


this is how I set up my personal boundaries……by becoming more conscious of how things impacted me.


I dont expect others to live the way I do…..but I know what is right for me.


in the end….we are all responsible for our own well-being.



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
August 7, 2009, 16:40

I for one must admit that I enjoy looking at pictures of attractive men, usually not totally exposed and usually not engaged in any sexual activity. It is certainly a far cry from the degradation of women, rather it is more akin to a celebration of the male form than anything else.


Ummm it is? So how much they are showing and whether or not they are actually engaged in a physical sexual activity is an indicator of the amount of degradation? What about men who offer phone sex? Lets be realistic, they are probably fully clothed and flicking through the mail when they are working so is this not degrading? Men who have any amount of clothing removed and are posed staring lustfully into a camera are in a sexual postion. I see them in TV ads all the time. Whether or not it is degarding is another question but the comparison between posed semi-naked men and “degarded women” is a fine-line don’t you think? What makes one a “celebration” and one porn?



gettingthere
 
Joined in 2008
August 7, 2009, 19:45

Ummm it is? So how much they are showing and whether or not they are actually engaged in a physical sexual activity is an indicator of the amount of degradation? What about men who offer phone sex? Lets be realistic, they are probably fully clothed and flicking through the mail when they are working so is this not degrading? Men who have any amount of clothing removed and are posed staring lustfully into a camera are in a sexual postion. I see them in TV ads all the time. Whether or not it is degarding is another question but the comparison between posed semi-naked men and “degarded women” is a fine-line don’t you think? What makes one a “celebration” and one porn?


Good point Sandy. I agree with you… I knew somebody was going to see some kind of flaw in my thinking. I knew there was one there, but I just couldn’t find it. Thanks. 🙂 I’m liking this discussion, I’ve never thought about some of these aspects of porn before (or I have, but not very deeply).



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
August 7, 2009, 20:20

It’s always good to get another perspective. I think porn is interesting when you take into consideration sexuality as well. Naturally, female oriented sexual imaging would be more “degrading” or offensive than male oriented because of your own preferances. The same goes for me. I always think of it when I see men walking around without shirts on. It bugs me. But do I mind when women wear short skirts or low cut dresses? Not at all. So care must be taken when talking about the two sexes and porn as well, to make sure what we are saying is true and not just our own bias.



forwardtherapy
 
Joined in 2009
August 7, 2009, 20:51

I wonder how much of our sensitivity to exposed skin is culturally conditioned? In countries where women are expected to totally cover themselves the sight of an ankle could cause some men (and women) to be highly aroused.


In Australia we still have restrictions preventing women from being ‘topless’ on the beach.


Yet if we went to some African countries, the sight of genitals at a dinner party would not ‘raise an eyebrow’.


Some swimming pools in England require people to shower in mixed showers with their costumes on. While in Norway it usually a requirement to shower naked- for hygiene reasons.


How and why do we set these standards about what people wear? Didn’t we all come into the world naked?


Incidentally, back to the porn topic, in Denmark there is porn on free-to-air television every evening. The government there says “why not?”



Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
August 8, 2009, 15:15

Possibly the issue that many of us feel uncomfortable about with porn is the potential for addiction……and that it can be an exploitive industry for some people in certain cultures. For some these two things are not an issue. that is some couples use it……and many people do it willing and make a profession out of it.


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