Thanks Jordan, I really appreciate you taking the time to write that!

Yeah I could very well be bi, but I dunno. I thought someone truly bisexual would be attracted to guys and girls at the same time all the time maybe? For me it's generally been almost two totally separate states, almost interchangeable, hence the coat analogy. I don't get it hey. For instance, when I'm fixated on a guy, like with the friend I mentioned, I can't bring myself to really 'feel' attracted to a girl. And likewise, when I've got feelings for a girl, I just don't find myself thinking about guys. BUT if I do, I feel really rotten for it. Like I'm doing something evil behind her back, and then I undermine and usually destroy the relationship before it even begins.

Oh and the friend I mentioned above from was from near Auckland NZ and your age so I was like… gahhh. Made my miss him ey 🙁

Anthony… thanks mate!

I totally get the concept of situational heterosexuality. I have a close friend, ex senior pastor, who is also gay and happily married with kids. He is 100% gay. His wife knows this, and was aware from day one of the marriage that he was attracted to men. I guess in those days it was a bit harder than it is now. But he has an incredible family, and he loves his wife dearly, though he admits that he is not sexually attracted to her in any way nor has been. He unfortunately was kicked out of his church as pastor because he was not ashamed in being open with the eldership about it. They reacted in fear. It was disgusting to see how they acted towards him. He never once acted on his feelings or lived a promiscuous life that would warrant any kind of discipline in a traditional church setting. It was a good old-fashioned burning at the stake.

I guess where I feel I differ is that I have had alot of relationships with girls, along with my experiences with guys, that have shown me that in those situations my level of attraction can be equal. In fact with my last girlfriend my problem was being aroused TOO MUCH. You can see why I've had such a confusing journey. Sometimes I wish I had married her, because she never feared or had a big problem with me also being attracted to guys. If anything me being open about it made it far less of a 'problem' (ie feeling tormented etc).

Hey Jordon – Ive been sick (Flu) so been off air lately. LOVE the No H8 avatar. its Awesome Mate !

On the Bisexual thing – thats an interesting question –

The theory (which I think dates back to Kinseys research – which brave and groundbreaking as it was – had a lot of methodological issues BTW) that there is a spectrum of sexuality – like a dial – and with Homosexuality on one side and Heterosexuality on the other – is – as I understand it (and I am happy to be corrected on this if anyone has read anything more recent on this than I have) ….not favoured any more…. That the bulk of males are one or the other.. with quite a small % of true bisexuals

If I remember rightly – this was discussed in a a separate creation – by chandler burr

http://www.nytimes.com/books/97/07/27/nnp/19945.html one of my favourite books and more accessible (I think) than LeVays books on the topic

Nonetheless – really what the research does show is that there seems to be multiple paths to create homosexuality (more than one cause) and that would hold true for Bi sexuality as well and you are what you are….

I know of plenty of Gay guys who have been married and have been able to have sex with women. They just prefer men (a lot)

My experience is that its rare to find males that genuinely have no preference either way – especially over time – once they have explored a bit but they do exist.

Danno –

What I would say is – dont box yourself in with expectations – walk a path that works with you.

I would suggest though – Especially given the story you tell about losing your job etc – that you look for a long term solution where you can be yourself and be open about who you are. As you say " in order to be integrous. " Thats really important and there is a cost to hiding bits of yourself. And there is something about your posts which resonate to me. It was my worry about people's internal integrity that cause that original forum – and I suspect integrity is similarly important to you ( Yes ? )

Its easy when you are celebate to hide things but the problem with that is when you meet someone – things can get complicated fast.

With my first partner – when i wasnt out – Birthdays, Christmas etc were horrible because neither of us were out to church, family and friends and there was an expectation from them to do things. I have vivid memories of crying on the phone one christmas day (before mobile phones too Im that old so I had to hide the tears) because we were 2000ks apart. And those little deceptions snowball – in part because you dont want to disappoint people that have had faith in you … But you cant tell when you will meet the right person too….

I was lucky my current partner waited some time and came interstate to ask me to date… but you want to be in a situation to be able to say yes… He is from an atheist family and he has the strongest sense of right and wrong and the most rigid and unbending code of morality and sense of social justice of ANYONE I have ever met. We are compatible because although our belief systems are very different out Values are amazingly strong about morality and right and wrong. So you never know who and where any how you will meet the right guy (or in your case – person )

I tell people now – going in to a situation (of course that can be funny Im a tall, boxer nosed guy with the dress sense of a tradey who likes cars, sci fi and motorbikes so often when I drop the subtle hint about my partner Alan in a new situation – people cant deal with it and revise it to

Ellen) – but the logic – which works well is – i dont want to be in a situation where Im not wanted for who and what I am.

BUT its taken me decades to get here so Im not in anyway suggesting this as a course of action now…. just letting you know it may be somewhere you may end up one day ! 🙂

I'm a bit of a heretic – I should warn you – so Im going to share one of my (many) heretical beliefs now (there forewarned is forearmed)

and its about Judgement and Temptation.

Jesus told us not to judge others and I believe thats because we are INCAPABLE of judging others.

Though shalt not steal – Yes but is it wrong to steal a loaf of bread to feed a starving child ? (especially if you dont the child will die – so then we clash with do not kill – have you through inaction killed ?) Not expecting an answer to that – My point is there can be complicated questions that come up in life and really only God can really judge someone because only God can see into our hearts and motivations and our thoughts and our history etc. (OK up to here thats quite biblical but here i get to my heretical bit)

I also suspect – (I dont know this but it comforts me to believe this) that other things are involved in Judgement.

Lets say that Im a greedy man – terribly greedy and so every day I go past a store and see fruit on display. and one day I steal some fruit… Not because Im hungry. Not because I need it just because I want it.

The temptation that I fought there was just plain Greed – that was it… nothing more.

Now lets say Im a poor man – extremely hungry but honest and I walk past there and all I can think of as I walk past there each day is how hungry I am and how he wont miss one piece of fruit. Im consumed by the temptation to take it because Im so hungry.

Both times Ive stolen. Is the sin equal in both cases ? I suspect not. I suspect that the AMOUNT of temptation you resist is a factor in sin and judgement. Maybe im wrong but thats what I believe. Dont know what you – or others think about that – but its the only way it makes sense to me !

So I believe if someone has a low libido and never has sex God may Judge something else (pride, greed, gluttony, not helping the poor ??? who knows) as a far greater sin for them than someone else who has a really high Libido and does have sex (outside of marriage I mean). Anyway – what ever happens – I'm happy to let God worry about it. Jesus spent far more time teaching about other things than he did about sex. I figure he knew what was important.

What Im really saying is that actually the modern church is far more hung up on sex as a sin than the bible really is (the sins it REALLY goes to town on actually are deceit, not helping the poor, the sick and being a hypocrite – these are by far the worst sins of all) So I reckon you are on the right track. Work on your self integrity and you know – who knows where you will end up (I've worked all across the world in places I would never have dreamed of when I was planting churches) but it will work out I reckon.

No worries Danno 🙂

ShadowBoxer mentioned a ‘spectrum of sexuality’. This is a good point. I could quite honestly believe that because sexuality is VERY diverse.

Oh and the friend I mentioned above from was from near Auckland NZ and your age so I was like… gahhh. Mate my miss him ey

Wow :O it’s such a small world! Especially with your friend coming from roughly the same area in New Zealand, that’s kinda weird when you think about it like that. I came across an awesome song I liked and the music composer came from Auckland, New Zealand too of all places in the world (though now he has been exported to Hollywood to make the big moolah).

Mark Petrie – From Within. Epic movie trailer-like song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzgXoiPLv4c

And thanks for the lovely comment on my avatar Shadow 😛 I didn’t want to copy the original NoH8 campaign logo, and so I used a different font in Photoshop. One I thought looked appropriate, yet clean and crisp at the same time 😛

Hello Danno,

Firstly I just want to say I've been away for 8 weeks (actually still am until the weekend) so have been absent from the forum over that time due to lack of Internet reception, so that is the reason I haven't replied until now.

Wow how courageous are you to be so open in your first posting. It takes a lot of courage to take that first step, well done to you. There are so many wonderful comments already on this post, I hope you have been able to connect to at least some of what has been said. I really like JD comments and will read his story when I can.

Without re reading everything again and noting who said what, I like the comment someone made about taking your time and how you can't undo things. This is excellent advice, as the saying goes " fools rush in where angels fear to tread" take one step at a time.

I don't know enough about Bi-sexual but considering you can be attracted to both sexes maybe it's worth exploring. You said. "I thought someone truly bisexual would be attracted to guys and girls at the same time all the time maybe?" you can't stick people in a box, that's one thing this site is about is helping people explore who they are in a safe, supporting, loving environment without judgment or condemnation and not put labels on them. That is what society and the church have done over the years. Be open to exploring and discovering all aspects about yourself.

As to what do you do and who do you tell. Small steps, like others have said don't rush in to tell everyone, use wisdom with who you tell, ones who you believe will support you, and accept you for you. As for what to do, I don't think anyone can tell you that, ever situation is different, only you can decide what is right for you. The church in particular has told you over the years what is the right way to go, to do, to think and believe. Now is the time for you to make your own choice, based on who you are and what is the right path for you. If you haven't already Anthony Venn Brown would be a really good one for you to connect with, as he has mentioned he has counseled and helped so many people through different aspects of coming out and of course his own personally situation with being heavily involved in ministry and the effects good and bad on that when he came out. 

It's great that you have accepted you can be gay and Christian, others have not come to that conclusion so easily and many still have that internal battle going on. God loves you and he wants you to be your authentic self, the man who he created you to be.

God bless