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magsdee
Disabled
Joined in 2006
March 9, 2008, 14:31

The point I am trying to make I guess is this, what makes us think we have it right? Since we agree that to get a proper understanding of what is written that it would be easier if they were alive, then obviously the written word is not perfectly understood by us so really our investigation into putting things into context with some scripture then is not wrong, since we all seem to be hoping that we have read it in context to what they were trying to get across. I know this point will be a debateable one so Im off this bus now also. 😉 either that or write in the sand 😆
March 9, 2008, 17:40

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, have tasted of the heavenly gift,were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God,and the powers of the world to come,

Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.


This is the scripture you are talking about Mark. For one “for those who have fallen away” if we search deep in our hearts we still believe, there is a big difference between completely rejecting Jesus and just backing off because of whatever in our life for a wee time, God knows when its out of fear or hurt or confusion and it isnt the same as in your heart purposing callously, in pure hatred driven hatred (not fueled by hurt) to completely reject God altogether but even for those that do I know of many who have reconciled. God is a God of mercy and mercy always overides judgement.(its in scripture)


I Personally havent experienced the powers of the world to come, I dont think many have, I really dont think many would fit into this criteria of not being able to be reconciled.


I posted in my tiredness last night LOL so excuse me if I came across a bit preachish or something in my first response. 😉


Not preachish at all(is that even a word? :lol:). I guess it comes down to the age-old Arminian-Calvinist debate. Do we choose God or does God choose us?


There is a similar verse where it says that for those who have blasphemed the Holy Spirit there is no forgiveness. I used to always wonder how you blasphemed the Holy Spirit. I remember reading that if you are worried that you have, you haven’t. Somebody who has is so depraved that they are not even concerned that they have. I guess it’s similar to falling away. If you are worried that you have fallen away irreparably you haven’t. So maybe there is hope for me yet. 😆


Either way I don’t think I’ll ever attend church or worship in the same way that I did before I came out. If I ever am reconciled with God it will be in a method or way that I haven’t even imagined yet.


I am very grateful to this website anyway. It has made me think more about spiritual matters than I have done for years and made me think that somehow, someday I will be able to reconcile my sexuality and spirituality. As Anthony said somewhere else, GLBTIQ people are the Gentiles of the 21st century.

Craig_Maynard
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 18:08

Hey you cute thing… God could never ever willingly give up on you! When I was there with you I felt God enormous love for you and it was so powerful that it shook me a little. Smile.


Hope is of an esscence of the things we can not see but its there. (not sure where in the bible it says that).


I never say never doubt becuase its an essential part of being human and we are going to doubt from time to time. Just know this… that “God so loved the world He gave his only begotten son, who ever so believes in him shall not perish but live forevermore”. This is God’s promise to us.


Once we have been burnt, roasted, cooked alive, and thrown out as trash… its hard 😯 . Very hard and so disheartening that I wish I could be there at that point in time to pull the person back physcially and just nuture them back to life again 😕 . I don’t know why things happen in that order… and I know that God wouldn’t want that to happen but sometimes we need it for ourselves to walk through the valley of death to come out of the other end ok. 🙂


What you said really touched me deeply and thank you. Hugs (with happy tears). 🙂


Craig.

magsdee
Disabled
Joined in 2006
March 9, 2008, 20:30

Preachish is a word, really it is 😉 😆


Youre in a good place Mark 😉 😀

magsdee
Disabled
Joined in 2006
August 5, 2008, 09:35

Gee have to get this one off my chest……

One thing I was taught as a Christian and I learnt from Jesus(via bible and inner witness) if someone is in genuine need and you can help, then help them no matter the driving distance if no other resourse is available ( I mean within reason), Im not boasting in saying this but I have left work early in the past, driven 2hrs or so just to make sure someone/s are either safe or given what they are in need of.

It just doesnt happen very often at all that people do that, its as though people go “oh yeh I help others (but looking closely only if its convenient for them even if their day is free ) and family seem to be the worst offenders with each other, Jesus said go the extra mile its as if you are doing it for him…..no wonder people are atheist or anti-christian when they see this kind of thing, to a world that needs Jesus we are not giving Jesus at all, we are being stingy, tight bummed Christians (and I dont mean monetarily)…..when ever someone asked me “where was Jesus when I was being robbed, hungry, sick etc” I would say sadly “im so sorry but there was no one around who would listen to him and do what he could to help you, its up to us and no one listened or was in a position around you(believing) so they could hear” and as we know Jesus will use anyone that will hear him (either via concsience or your heart)…..what an opportunity wasted to show people who he really is!!!!!!!!!!!!! (I am not saying this about people who have genuine ccommitments they cant leave or is impossible to leave)

Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
August 5, 2008, 18:08

I guess the only Jesus anyone will ever see is the one they see reflected in our lives and behaviour.

magsdee
Disabled
Joined in 2006
August 5, 2008, 20:39

Exactly.. I know none of us are perfect but we could at least be mindful 🙁

robert
 
Joined in 2008
August 5, 2008, 22:01

On the Topic of Salvation and who will be granted eternal life…


I do agree with you that Jesus’ role and what he did is essential in enabling us to have a right relationship with God. But I don’t think it is as simple as “knowing” Jesus’, its more about having faith in God rather than knowing Jesus’


Abraham, we know, is granted eternal life and will be present in the kingdom of heaven, and he is granted this through his faith in God the father, not Jesus the Son. Abraham was before scriptures were even written prophesying that Jesus would come. His faith was based on no scriptures at all…


David, we also know, will be in Heaven, he had some scriptures, but he has no way of knowing Jesus and the solution that God had. He like Abraham was credited righteousness because of his faith in God the father.


I believe it is the faith in God that is the essential part of our salvation, not the knowledge of Jesus himself… Jesus is also asked in Luke, about the greatest commandments, and how this lawyer would gain eternal life. and Jesus says to love the Lord you God with all your heart and to love your neighbor as yourself, with no mention of Jesus himself.


Please don’t read this as diminishing what Jesus did on the cross… the reason I say this is that what Jesus did on the cross was essential for our salvation, but you don’t have to know about it, its more that you know that God is all powerful and that you have faith in Him, and if you have faith in God you know that he will (future) and has (now past) provide a solution to be right with God. IE it is only through the cross that we are saved… but it is the faith in God the father that is required.

Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
August 5, 2008, 23:29

i didn’t know you were a theologian Rob……. 😆

robert
 
Joined in 2008
August 5, 2008, 23:36

i didn’t know you were a theologian Rob……. 😆


I know enough to get myself in trouble… but its more many many years of bible studies at church, uni, school, beach missions… I guess good thing comes from attending those crazy anglican things like MYC
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