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Letting the cork out of the bottle

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Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
January 20, 2008, 17:55

it would be great if you could join us in the parade this year Craig….but I guess your partners guidedog would become too agitated with all the noise etc.



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
January 20, 2008, 21:11

I just thought I would tack this question on the end of this link because its not really important enough to deserve its own thread and it has to do with homosexual sex in a round about kind of way. Has anyone read homosexuality in perspective by Masters and Johnson? I really want to understand it but I’m too lazy to actually read it since it reads like a medical journal, and there is a very good reason I quit med school.


Even though I havn’t read it I would feel safe in recomending this book because I have read the ‘dumbed down’ versions of their previous work on human sexual responce and human sexual inadequacy. So if you can get past the language barrier it’s very facinating… Sorry I’ll stop ranting about books now 😳



Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
January 21, 2008, 12:01

sorry Sandy….havent read or heard of it.



Liberation Rob
 
Joined in 2007
January 21, 2008, 17:43

been there done that… yadda yadda…


so in the end – why do you think it’s so important for us older poofs and dikes to maintain the rage comrade… so our younger sisters and brothers don’t have to go through the same stunted emotional and sexual development many of us older ones are still dealing with in our – 40’s, 50’s, 60’s and 70’s


for God’s sake – it’s emotionally difficult enough dealing with our hormones at 16, etc and the rest of it… without the extra worry of having our heads kicked-in, if we dare venture outside into the street holding hands


no wonder so many glbt’s drop out of school and never make any tertiary or vocational success of their lifes like our hetro brethen take for granted


never mind the guilt comrade – feel the rage and help bring on the R-E-V-O-L-U-T-I-O-N, today!



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
January 21, 2008, 20:55

What do you mean by ‘rage comrade’ Rob? It sounds rather like a whole lot of angry gay people getting together to be angry at the straight people who have done them some kind of ‘injustice’. But then maybe thats not it at all.



Liberation Rob
 
Joined in 2007
January 22, 2008, 00:08

I thought it was rather self-explanatory… myself


most queers I know lead quiet lives and just move in circles that don’t effect ’em


consequently they are largely invisible in the professions, jurisprudence and the church


the rest of the world is ‘actin-up’


I’m just puttin it out there for a re-action


elsewhere I’ve started a thread, lamenting the lack of queers making a presence in the salvos and baptists for an example….


I’m just suggesting in 2008 – I reckon now’s as good as any other time to start makin demands!!!


and if this is still too vague for you… specifically let me say that considering this is a queer aussie forum for recognition and improvement of glbt’s within the penticostal world – not one reference or organising of any movement out there in the real world for such outcomes has occurred as a result of this ‘freedom to be’ forum – namely, sit-ins, forming a church for queers and insisting on AOG recognition or even a group of AOG’s queers speaking out for better recognition – or even if we could get a few queers to own up to their sexuality in Hillsong so the whole world could watch the politically correct seeker friendly mask fall off!!!! and then we could bathe in the warm glow of the media frenzie that would eventuate.


heck wouldn’t it be great if only this were to occur – that a thread were to start here and be solely dedicated to acting up and supporting those individuals who’d choose to do so, namely:


current penticostal church members

who now choose to be recognised as firstly glbt members and secondly to demand not just their recognition from their respective denominations but for their affirmation as glbt christians…. by way of that denominations – mission statement, employment practices, liturgies and social actions



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
January 22, 2008, 07:58

As far as I am aware F2b is more of a ‘space’ than an action group. F2b has no agenda, that is why people who have no religious affiliation and people like myself who are quite conservative religiously are able to co-exist on this forum. To start an action group would take away this unique aspect which makes F2b such an unusual and helpful place.


I guess I have always seen the purpose of F2b as not about getting somewhere or acheiving something per se but creating a community of people to explore the here and now, to discuss issues openly and to encourage one another.



Liberation Rob
 
Joined in 2007
January 22, 2008, 13:06

sure that’s fine – you can do your thing…. but allow others to do theirs


by-the-way… I’ve never understood the concept of a conservative queer – to me it’s an incompatible juxta-position.


next, you’ll be tellin me that you’re a Republican voter!!! (or even worst a liberal voter)



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
January 22, 2008, 16:10

Of course, maybe Anthony can give us both a better idea of what F2b is really about though the guidelines pretty much say it all.


Why is a conservative gay person such a juxtaposition? It’s possible to be gay and not want to be so for religious reasons and for other reasons as well. Ex-gay programs, specialised ministries and support groups are full of people who take a conservative view on theology, namely that homosexuality is unnatural and also admit to a gay orientation.


Being gay is not something you choose, being Christian is (leaving aside the predestination debate for a second) so for those of us who choose to be Christian and are not convinced of pro-gay takes on the issue being a conservatively minded gay person is about the only accurate label left.


Our foremost and most important identity is as a human created in the image of God, nothing surpasses that least of all a gay ‘identity’. In the end if homosexuality IS unnatural then we were not created that way and its possible to see the issue as something which lies outside of our Christian identfication all together. I am a Christian because I choose to be, because I believe that the teachings written in the bible are true and accurate. I am also attracted to women through no fault of my own and believe its pointless and even detrimental to lie about this or to pretend to be heterosexual.


In the end gay people are as diverse as anyone else when it comes to their beliefs and political affiliations (though you will be pleased to know that I am not a republican, when last in Australia I voted for the Christian democratic party :lol:). To say that because you have an inclination towards homosexuality you can not believe the bible as true is like saying that any sinner struggling with anything can not believe the bible to be true if it contradicts their sinful behaviour at times, which in truen would suggest that no one believes the bible because everyone sins…



Anthony Venn-Brown
 
Joined in 2005
January 23, 2008, 00:54

yep…..i’ve looked at different ways of bringing change and getting the message across…..some people do better at some methods….I’m pretty happy with the way i do things.


Many Christians already perceive queers as angry tormented militant souls….some forms of activism only reinforce that. others break down the preconceived ideas and build bridges…..we all much choose which is the right path for us.


1. Protest

2. Dialogue

3. Living the truth by example

4. Destroy the enemy


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