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"Shame" and "Guilt". What is the difference?

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Boi70
 
Joined in 2007
February 28, 2011, 18:55

As people who have come from a Christian background – we are fairly familiar with the terms “Shame” and ‘Guilt”. The are used fairly liberally in reading material and in messages from the pulpit or in general discussion.


And then as we realise that we don’t fit the mould of the Christianity that we were told or thought was normal, we have to find freedom from “Shame” and / or “Guilt”.


As I tried to work through my own issues – the conflict between my christian beliefs / faith and my sexuality, I spent a lot of time trying to understand why I was gay, and I would say that I felt ashamed and would also feel guilty. But then I didn’t really understand what was “guilt” and what was “shame”. I realised that my lack of understanding of what they were, and how they happened was probably one of the reasons why I didn’t feel or act like I was free to be me.


As I search the web, I found that this is a subject for discussion for many sites in the US.


Interestingly, “Shame” has been defined as our experience in reference to how other people perceive our actions; guilt is experienced in reference to how we perceive your actions. And it is also possible to experience both at the same time. Well, this is what the webpage discussion at the following link stated.


http://www.content4reprint.com/culture-and-society/social-issues/shame-and-guilt-over-being-homosexual.htm


Anyway, how do others feel / think about these comments about “Guilt” and “Shame”?



Ann Maree
 
Joined in 2008
March 1, 2011, 20:21

Hi Jason


For me, the following are my subjective experiences related to shame and guilt. Regarding shame, I want the earth to open up and swallow me in order to hide myself from others’ painfully harsh judgments. Shame is an unbearable state of feeling ‘less than’, dirty, hideous, revolting, besmirched… Guilt involves taking blame for something and can be similarly painful and burdensome. I think these emotional states can be draining and block us from joyful living if we don’t acknowledge them. That said, they are part of normal human experiencing, and as with any emotions, can reveal important things to us if we are prepared to sit with them.


Thanks for starting this discussion. I’m interested to hear what others think.


Blessings,


Ann Maree



ammi
 
Joined in 2011
March 4, 2011, 08:09

I have been preparing and leading some studies on Genesis 1 to 11 over recent weeks and this week we are going to look at the story of ‘The Fall’ in Genesis 3. I was struck again about how Adam and Eve were ashamed, when they had done what they weren’t supposed to do… and so they hid from each other and from God.


I know in my own experiences of shame… I want to hide, and somehow that feeds the shame. I am ashamed about my mental health illness and have found it very difficult to talk about and to acknowledge and accept to myself and others. I know that the way through is to talk about it… and discover that people can still accept me and love me… and that somehow, I’m trusting that I will learn to accept and love myself.


So I guess I feel ashamed about who I am… and feel guilty about what I do, which doesn’t meet my standards and values. It is odd, as I don’t think I feel too much guilt as I know that I am forgiven, but the shame remains somehow at the core of my being. Shame that I need to feel loved…


How sad is that!



Ann Maree
 
Joined in 2008
March 4, 2011, 09:48

Hi ammi


I believe that shame and guilt can be misplaced or that we can create it ourselves.


Re Genesis and the fall. I have a different take on that. I believe Adam and Eve were meant to go outside the comfort of Eden and that it was a sign of growth and maturity that they would venture beyond the safety of what they knew. I think it’s always necessary to extend ourselves beyond our comfort zones and that if we don’t do that we limit our choices or allow someone else to choose for us. And we were given free choice as a gift afterall. Now I realise this may seem like a radical idea to many and feel free to consider, accept or reject as you wish. I’m not saying that anything goes or advocating anarchy but I am saying that we need to explore the limits of what’s right and wrong otherwise we never really know for ourselves. And I firmly believe God wants us to do that. In other words, the “fall” was a good thing, a fall from illusionment into active learning and life with all it’s wonders and pitfalls. And I think it’s human nature that we try to venture back to Eden because we want a comfortable life, or a womb-like experience..


You make a good point that shame and guilt can feed each other.


1 in 5 people suffer with mental illness and that’s the ones we know about so it’s probably higher than that. And every person has issues of some sort even if not formally diagnosed. In fact the people dealing with their issues are often less troubled than the ones who are not. I just came back from a conference for mental health/counselling practitioners (110 participants) and it confirmed what I knew already. All of us are the same. We all have shame, guilt, vulnerability, foibles, joy, weaknesses, pain, the ability to love and the need to love and be loved etc. In a real sense I think it’s normal to have issues and I would think it strange if people didn’t! The important thing is to be acknowledging them gently and seeing how they can work better for us in our lives.


ammi, you are completely normal for needing to be loved and feeling the vulnerability in that. Try not to be so hard on yourself. It would also be worthwhile to explore the shame around that.


Blessings,


Ann Maree



davidt
 
Joined in 2009
March 4, 2011, 10:46

I tend to agree that shame is what we feel when others judge us. Guilt comes from our view of ourselves before God.


However the two can be related. The biggest mistake I made for years was to make my views of myself to be the same as what homophobic people, especially in the church, had of gays and therefore of me. I was ashamed to be gay. I hated myself. Heterosexual sinners were so much sinners than I was etc.


That can cause a lot of damage. Why shouldn’t I accept God’s love for me as my model to love myself? God’s love is always unconditional and totally accepting.


I am now proud to be gay and enjoy being gay very much.



ammi
 
Joined in 2011
March 4, 2011, 17:04

Thanks so much for your thoughtful response, Ann Maree. I was interested in your understanding of Genesis 3… gives me something new to think about.


I know that a lot of people suffer from mental illness, and many people who haven’t said anything to anyone. I know that it doesn’t make me less valuable… and yet that is so often how I feel.


People call me gentle… I guess it would be helpful if I could release some of that gentle energy towards myself….



Boi70
 
Joined in 2007
March 6, 2011, 21:08

Thanks Ann Maree, Ammi and DavidT for sharing your thoughts.

Interestingly, I also read recently that it is a core for us as humans to want to connect with others. So, I wholeheartedly agree with Ann Maree when she said that it is ‘completely normal for needing to be loved and feeling the vulnerability in that’.

I suppose that “Shame” and “Guilt” have the potential to block “our connection” with others – whether they are complete strangers, an acquaintance, our co-workers, our friends and even our families.


Like DavidT mentioned, it is good to be able to say that ‘I enjoy being gay’ and that in each of our journeys, we can each get to a point, no matter how long it takes, where we can accept ‘God’s love’ for each of us – to know that we are wonderfully normal. It is so good to be comfortable in our own skins. :bigsmile:



Ann Maree
 
Joined in 2008
March 6, 2011, 22:22

Hi jason


Yes I agree that shame and guilt can block our intimacy with others and also that it is really good to be comfortable in our own skins. At the same time, I believe that the sooner we acknowledge that shame and guilt have a normal albeit unpleasant place in our human experiences, the sooner we can be more comfortable with life and being in our skins. Just a thought.


Blessings,


Ann Maree


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