Your right in saying that some people in the church have created that equation. However, increasingly there are people who are compassionate and understanding as well. I have found that very few construct the homosexuality = promiscuity idea out of their own prejudice, most simply don’t know that this age old concept is wrong.

I think I have posted on this previously and used an example from my own youthful endeavors. 😆 When I was eighteen or so I was at a party and the boys there were filling up condoms as water balloons, the girls were giggling and pointing and laughing and I asked the very innocent question “what are condoms?” at eighteen this question was considered hilarious. But condoms were simply not apart of my experience, how was I to know?

For many people especially those within the church gay people are simply not apart of their experience. I am reminded of a scene in the ‘fluffy’ romantic comedy “Imagine me, Imagine you” where upon hearing that Luce is a lesbian Heck replies “oh… well… well done!”. Evidently Heck has no idea what to say and that scene never fails make me laugh. The example is hardly a in direct correlation to some of the reactions we have all experienced from the church but the same lack of knowledge fueled by lack of experience is the same.

I came across a young man who was making some bad joke or another about gay men during a bible study one night. After it finished I asked him why he felt it was ok to say derogatory things about gay people especially during a bible study of all places! He then went on to describe the rampant promiscuity and general bad behavior of the gay community. He could not name one gay person he knew to behave in this way. He received his information from the media.

In general the Mardi Gras gets about seven or eight minutes coverage every year on the major news networks, more on the ABC or SBS stations. So what picture is painted for the general public? This year I saw men in spandex jumpsuits holding sex toys and shouting things that needed to be blanked out on prime time television. I saw women on motorbikes drinking so much you had to worry for their safety. I have been to the Mardi Gras and what I experienced as one of the crowd and what I see on television are far removed from each other. The media wants ratings and sex sells. Men’s magazines most often display women as lesbian sex objects, gay men in movies are portrayed as male gigolos and the list goes on.

If church-going Australians do not know any same-sex attracted people personally and only have the media representations to influence them then I can’t say I blame them for thinking gay people are promiscuous. Does this make their assumptions correct or the way they treat gay people ok? Of course not! However it is something that gay people within a Church need to be aware of. A Christian response demands that we educate these people not condemn them, we forgive not judge. There are of course the few nutcases who have a particular prejudice against homosexual people but they are not as over-populated within the church as many think.

Maggie,

How are you feeling? How did the rehab go?

It seems to me as if you have already answered your own question. You have asked why am I homosexual and also claimed that homosexuality is innate… well if that is true then there is your answer. If homosexuality is innate then God is responsible for it because God created all human beings and knows every hair on our head.

What I think you are asking for is a defense of the idea that homosexuality is not innate, this I can give you although I am sure you have heard it all before. The most predominant theory is an inadequate relationship with the same-gender parent. I can understand why so many people balk at this one, there comes a stage where blaming the parents just doesn’t cut it. However I have come to understand that it comes down to the child’s perception of the relationship more than the actual facts of the relationship. For example say a father had to go off to war and was gone for many months, a son might perceive that his father has abandoned him where in actual fact the father loves and missed his son dearly.

In the words of Andy Comiskey “in joining with the same sex erotically the needy child within seeks in adult form the affirmation and emotional intimacy from the same sex that was never properly attained during childhood.” Other identified causes include sexual molestation, temperament, abnormally close relationship with the opposite sex parent and lack of identification with ones gender. Lets not go into the details of these. To explain them would be like the woman at my church asking if I had read Romans 1. So what do they all mean, aside from the jargoned psychobabble? Essentially that God did not create anyone homosexual. Environmental influences have caused for various reasons people to attach erotic significance to the same sex.

No people should not ignore or repress their same sex attraction, we all know that only makes us miserable. It’s narrow minded to assume that there are only two polar opposites here, to believe homosexuality is innate or to deny it completely… if those are the only options available then of course people will have big problems with the latter. There is a third way, applauded by few, to admit to and accept a same sex attraction, to be honest and open and to recognize that in order to strive for Godliness one must be celibate.

Yes human beings were created to be social and that is why, for the homosexual person especially, friendships are so important. Sex is not a right in the bible; God did not create it as one. Sex is a privilege given to those who marry for marital wellbeing and for procreation. Understandably people who are unmarried want to have sex as well but God has placed restrictions on its expression. Of course if you are not attracted to the opposite sex you shouldn’t have sex with them, as if they are some kind of consolation prize! That’s despicable.

God did not make us homosexual and therefore God did not single us out. If, for the sake of this argument ‘society’ is right and homosexuality is a burden then we are indeed called to follow Jesus with it. Maggie, you come at the issue with a predetermined point of view. Imagine for a second if you can that you truly believe that it actually is a burden and Jesus says “follow me regardless of this struggle, I know my demands are tough but you can do it because I love you”. If you truly believed that this burden grieved God as all our burdens of sin do then you would WANT to get rid of it as soon as possible wouldn’t you? I don’t know whether this can be fully achieved or not but I understand people’s desire to be free from sin not because it enables you to marry and have sex but because your sin grieved God and to live is to serve Christ, indeed it is to follow Him.

The very word ‘burden’ has negative connotations. It is my understanding that when Jesus says “pick up your cross and follow me” he is alluding to his own death. Jesus’ death was something He endured for a greater purpose, to save Gods people from their sins. In the same way our crosses or burdens must be endured for a greater purpose, to glorify God. Not once did you hear Jesus say “Oh goody I’m going to die”, like it was something He wanted for Himself or something that he celebrated. Jesus endured great physical and emotional pain, He cried out to God in the garden to take this cup away from Him. To suggest that the choices we make in relation to our burdens make no difference because all we are called to do is follow Jesus is to miss the point.

Lets pick a less controversial burden such as greed. We all agree that greed is a sin and therefore a burden. Jesus does not say “well that’s ok, there is no need to try and stop being greedy to follow me”. The act of following requires the act of submitting and to submit we must do what Jesus tells us, Jesus says don’t be greedy and so if we continue to be greedy and do not try to rectify this are we really following him?

To preempt your next comment no Jesus doesn’t specifically say anything about homosexuality but then neither does he say anything about elderly abuse or environmentalism and in the words of Joe Dallas “does that justify us sawing down rainforests or taking a baseball bat to grandma?” We need to consider the entirety of scripture. In the very act and nature of following Jesus we are called to “stop” any sin.

are all of the worlds population of homosexual people meant to live a life of celibacy and completely ignore the fact and battle with the idea they can never have the intimacy they crave and long for that we were inately inborn with actually God given? I doubt anyone can satisfactorily answer this.

I can. The answer is no.

Sandy certainly we have the media to blame for much of the misconceptions about gay and lesbian people. It is always ignorance we are dealing with. When someone criticizes the Mardi Gras parade for example….mostly when asked ‘have you actually seen the entire event’ the answer is no. Like the young man at your bible study who condemned all gays as immoral…’do you know any’….the answer again is no.

that is why i think it is so important…..if someone feels so called……… to go back into the churches and break down the misconceptions and preconcieved ideas by living a life that demonstrates the truth. “my morality is a choice, my sexual orientation however isn’t”.

When they see it in the flesh…..and incarnation if you like……then people will become more realistic about sexual orientation.

I feel that at Hillsong and with the Assemblies of God I’ve been able to have a degree of influence by changing peoples thinking. The change that needs to happen is very much in our own hands.

Christians can’t condemn homosexuals its unbiblical in this age of grace and the lessons Jesus taught on judgement. Gay christians must ensure thier life reflects the master and oozes love of God, love of others and love of self…..made in his image.

This idea is based not on chruch doctrine or lay peoples opinions but on the word of God… faultless and unchanging.

It’s only faultless and unchanging to those who believe what they do without questioning purely because they have been brainwashed into it by the fundamentalist church.

You didn’t answer my previous question Sandy. Do you have an eye or an arm missing? Do you always wear hats to church? Are you confident picking up venomous snakes? If not you do not truly believe that the Bible is faultless and unchanging.