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Homophobia?

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Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 11:42

I am writing this because I am so often accused of homophobia, no sorry, of promoting homophobic beliefs that I am begining to doubt if anyone knows what the word even means. Here is what I have discovered it to mean*.


Homphobia implies a phobic condition that the accused most likely does not really have. A phobia according to the Diognostic and Statistical Manual of the American Psychiatric Association, is defined as “an irrational fear or dread of an object or activity leading to a significant avoidance of the dreaded object”.


In the comedy movie what about Bob? a psychiatric patient is beset with phobias, claustrophobia being one of them. When approaching a small space, such as an elevator or crowded bus, he psychs himself up, mutters under his breath and tries to endure being in a small space for a short period of time.


Assuming that homosexuality is the object or activity that homophobes dread shouldn’t we all be like Bob? When seeing a homosexual, if truely homophobic shouldn’t we have to psych ourselves up, muttering under our breath and barely enduring the prescence of a homosexual even for a short period of time?


Yet we don’t. The Christian man or woman who speaks to homosexuals, works alongside them, or relates to them in anyway, could hardly be said to have a ‘phobic responce’. Their feelings towards homosexuals may be negative but that in itself does not constitute phobia.


There also seems to be a premature assumption that negative reactions to homosexuality are phobias. I have come to believe that negative reactions to homosexuals stem from two sources: prejudices or convictions.


Webster defines prejudice as: “an opinion about something without adequate basis”. By that definition there is a great deal of prejudice against homosexuals. But it is not phobia it is a sin.


By contrast conviction according to Webster “is a state of being convicted: a strong belief”. It is entirely possible to have a strong belief about homosexuality without prejudice or phobia. That, I beleive, is the case with most Christians. Even Mel White, who throughout his book condemns homophobia in the church agrees that “thoughtful students of the Scriptures may disagree on the subject of homosexuality”. Andrew Sullivan, the well-known gay journalist goes even further, “Perhaps the most depressing and fruitless debate about homosexuality is to treat all version of this [conservative Christian] argument as the equivilant of bigotry. They are not. At its most serious, it [the Christian prohibition against homosexuality] is not a phobia; its an argument.


In truth, the term homophobia can be used accuratly in very few cases. Rather, prejudice describes unfounded negative attitudes towards homosexuals, while conviction describes the beliefs of people holding the conservative view on homosexuality.


* Dallas, J.The Gay Gospel? (2007) Harvest House Publishers, Oregon.



Shantih Shantih Shantih
 
Joined in 2008
March 9, 2008, 13:12

Amen! There is a huge gulf between homophobes, those prejudiced against homosexuals, and those who disagree with them and their [assumed] lifestyles. It is only by way of ignorance or manipulation that certain words come to mean other things, and I for one have never believed ‘tolerance’ means ‘agreement.’*


* And I should know! 😀


March 9, 2008, 14:39

Amen! There is a huge gulf between homophobes, those prejudiced against homosexuals, and those who disagree with them and their [assumed] lifestyles. It is only by way of ignorance or manipulation that certain words come to mean other things, and I for one have never believed ‘tolerance’ means ‘agreement.’*


* And I should know! 😀


I agree. However I disagree with Sandy that most Christians fall into the merely disagree camp. The vast of majority of fundamentalist Christians are in the prejudiced camp.


I have a mate in Queensland who I grew up with. I have not come out to him. He is a fundamentalist Christian and the way he talks about gay people is absolutely disgusting. I’m pretty sure that if I told him I was gay he would want nothing more to do with me. His attitude is not unique. It’s pretty stock standard for fundamentalist Christians.



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 14:59

Funny isn’t it? That the majority of Christians I know are convicted and the majority of Christians you know are prejudiced. In the end we don’t know every conservative Christian personally to be able to ask them. What I can say and what you will see in the recent official documents of any conservative, mainstream church is conviction not prejudice.


So to say the “Church” as an institution is prejudiced is wrong, some people in it may be but by no means are the Churches negative attitudes towards homosexuality lack an adequate basis.



luke_18
 
Joined in 2008
March 9, 2008, 15:02

i agree with raskdog above… the large majority of christians that i have had contact with would fit nicely in the prejudiced category. As sandy wrote, the webster dictionary defines prejudice as “opinion .. without adequate basis” … and in my opinion the basis on which most christians form their opinion regarding homosexuality is rediculously inadequate!! I have had good christian mates of mine (who dont know that im gay) say to my face, things like “homosexuality is the most disgusting thing in the world” and “i just lost my appetite” (after hearing a story of two men in a relationship) …. it almost seems that this attitude is getting close to a fear… which would sort of lead us back to the true meaning of homophobia – an IRRATIONAL fear.



luke_18
 
Joined in 2008
March 9, 2008, 15:03

yeah sorry Sandy… definately disagree with you. In my experience the church is prejudiced with a few “convicted” attitudes sprinkled in there.



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 15:16

Is it fair to condemn the entire conservative church because of a few bad eggs? The comments you mentioned Luke are without biblical basis. So lets for the sake of the argument stick to bible believing Christians. The bible provides an adequate basis for conviction. I am convinced that the majority of conservative Christians have never really given homosexuality all that much thought, and why should they. The conservative argument stands that homo-eroticism is sin. Lets be honest here, while you will hear the majority of conservative Christians confirm this view you won’t see them throwing up their lunch or running away in fear simply because you walked in the room or happened to be kissing your lover.



Craig_Maynard
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 15:33

Wow Sandy, you really do take the time to present information… I do see where you are coming from and its so hard for me to disagree with you – you put up a very convincing dialogue. You have seem to hit the nail on the situation in the Church or Christian Community more so on the various Christians.


I actually thought homophobic are those that reacts when finding out that we are Gay. Its funny when a Christian friend says “yuk, men holding hands and kissing” eeeehhhhhuuuwww and I am sitting there trying not to visualise what the straight couple do together in their most heightened senses (eg sex). I actually thought what they were experiencing was homophobic until you broach the subject. Maybe we should explore the actual correct diagnoses and perhaps using it to help heal the rift within the church over us.


Now I am starting to understand that Homophobic is a situation where people are so repulse and have a reaction to us being in their presence. Perhaps its a generic term that describes the behaviour of people which is homophobic but the actual specifics such as predjudice, conviction and ignorance. I think its because of my Deafness I see a third element which is ignorance because no matter how much you explain they still think in a particular way. Hmmmm what does everyone think?


Sandy I would never thought you as a homophobic 😯 … I see you as an intelligent person who is questioning everything and enoucrages us to look at issues from a various perspective – its rather enlightening to see what you wrote and it helps challenge my way of thinking and how I perceive things. And it helps me explain things clearer to my Christian brothers/sister when they are ready and want to know. 🙂


Hmmmm


Craig.



Sandy
 
Joined in 2007
March 9, 2008, 15:46

Well I am glad to have helped. The information I got came largely from Joe’s Dallas’s book cited at the bottom and is not actually all my own work.


In the circumstance of you explaining your views and them continuing to believe their own conclusions no matter how hard you try to explain is probably an example of conviction and not ignorance. It depends on the person I supose. If you were talking to someone who had studied the scriptures carefully and done the reseach then conviction is more plausable. If the person simply didn’t ‘get it’ because they couldn’t understand what would motivate someone into a same-sex relationship then that is ignorance.


In saying that I think ignorance is a big issue too. Many of the prejudiced reactions that do come from conservative Christians have at their root ignorance.


*on a side note I get accused of homophobia alot, many of the posts here label the conservative stance ‘homophobic’ which by extention labels me homophobic too because I agree with the stance. It’s pretty funny actually, the thought of me having an irrational fear of myself, muttering and so forth and not being able to talk to or interact with myself, it doesn’t make any sense.



luke_18
 
Joined in 2008
March 9, 2008, 15:56

Sandy… in your last comment you said “is it fair to condem the entire conservative church because of a few bad eggs”. Here you have already made an assumption! the church is made up of PEOPLE and thus YES there will be differing opinions amongst it. However unless you have conducted an Australia wide survey of the church’s attitude to homosexuality, it is unfair for you to assume that i have just “condemed the entire conservative church based on a few bad eggs”. All i was stating in my last comment is that my EXPERIENCE (and NO i am not generalising the WHOLE church here) i have come across a majority of prejudiced attitudes.

Also, please dont tell me my comments are without bible basis. because thats just dumb. especially when i didnt even make any comments that should have had any biblical basis.


all that aside. let me tell you what my main problem here is. You said “lets just stick to bible believing christians”. This is the fundamental issue for me. It is the bible that has catalysed (if not caused) the prejudiced attitudes!! The bible in my opinion most definatley does NOT provide an adequate basis for ‘conviction’. Quite the opposite really. I could go on for ages as to why this is so, but i wont. I will just say that to have a decent (healthy) argument regarding this issue, you cannot assume that the bible is an adequate basis for conviction. Guess it all comes down to the validity of the bible in this case, and until the validity of the bible is proven (which is not), it is extremely foolish and wrong to class a group of individuals (in this case homosexuals) as ‘sinful’ or ‘wrong’ or ‘dirty’ – which are the exact things that have created the ‘conviction’ (in your experience) or prejudice (in my experience).


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