My immediate thought is that you seem to be seeing all the best possible things about marriage and all the worst possible things about never-being-married-’cause-only-heterosexuals-can-do-it.

For instance, who said that a never-married can’t have children. Including biological ones?

And what exactly makes you think a never-married is more likely to have a life of loneliness? I would have thought in some ways it was easier to find a (same-sex) partner. Also, I’m pretty sure many people who ‘come out’ of a marriage lose all that family – spouse and children – that you are jealous of.

That’s what you seem to not be taking into account most of all. Let’s accept that a married person with kids ‘has more’. Well, then they also have more to lose. Coming out is a tough enough experience for anyone, but when there are such close relationships at stake, I can only imagine that it send the stress levels even higher. I mean, let’s start with telling your spouse, whom you almost certainly LOVE, that it’s not the KIND of love they thought.

– orfeo (thoroughly single, before you ask)

Yes, marriage is ‘revered’, at least in Christian society. But now, sometimes, you’re just comparing married to single and a heterosexual single person would be in the same position. You think straight singles don’t suffer being surrounded by married couples and their babies?

Yes people who are married have better health. But so do people who are PARTNERED. Again, comparing to single people, full stop.

As for economic resources, well… that’s mostly due to laws that should be fixed soon.

I get completely, though, what it’s like to sit through a marriage ceremony and think ‘this will never happen for me’. Been there.

I wouldn’t overestimate the ‘feeling of acceptance’ that a married gay person feels – once they’ve acknowledged to themselves that they are gay. I read something recently about how being accepted/praised has no value to most people if they know that it’s based on a falsehood.

It would be interesting to find out how many ex-married gays and lesbians do in fact continue to have relationships with kids and grandkids. Probably a lot do in the long run. But I’ve certainly heard quite a few stories where there’s been a gap, often of quite a few years, before there’s acceptance.

Not everyone has ‘designer babies’. Some people manage with a turkey baster…

Raskdog

I’m in a happy patnership at the moment but the fact is that if we ever break up I would be on my own.

Ive been in a few happy r’ships and sure I ended up on my own and single when we broke up, thats life for anyone gay or straight and its hard to find the “right” one again for anyone gay or straight.

I was without a partner for many many years and actually quite happy with just friends and enjoyed my life until I thought ok I am ready to find someone again. The way I see it, if you cant be happy alone, what makes you think you will be totally fulfilled partnered up???? Sure we are happy at the time but “because of” that someone else, we cant expect people to fulfill our emptiness, thats unfair, sure its great to have someone but I see my partner as adding to my life and enriching what I already feel inside, she doesnt fill a void in myself, she shares the life I already have and thats all I ever wanted, was to share what I enjoy with someone else, it wasnt out of lonliness I partnered, it was out of wanting a special someone to share myself with and to have them do the same.

I know it can be different for everyone and I accept that but seeing my friends marry and have happy lives always made me happy for them, I didnt envy what they had, sure I wanted to find someone to do that with but I wasnt miserable about it……..also I had a sense of acceptance in myself, even in the face of rejection, sure I cried and got down at times like that but not for long, it just made me stronger in my conviction of who I am and surrounded myself with people of like mind or such for support because they are out there if we look but I also had a strong r/ship with God, not the church and that made a mountain of difference.

Im not boasting or trying to poo poo anything said here by saying all this but gees we make our lives what they are to a degree (and I mean to a degree, please dont misunderstand me), Ive had enough lemons thrown at me in everyway, including having MS and Arthritis which means I deal with chronic pain every day and limited mobility and so a limited everyday life and on top of that everything else that comes with coming out as well and a past I wont discuss on here, did I sit down and cry and get depressed at times? yes by all means but I didnt stay down and made it my priority to stay up as much as possible and look at the good things in life and in people cause man we dont have to look far to find enough sadness and misery if we want to….(Im not having a go here at anyone and Im not saying this to gain sympathy either and I havent been battered down just the once but many times each time I got back up and am sure many can relate to that 🙁 ).

When people complain about how miserable they feel because they have a cold, in comparison to me sure it would seem very minor but I dont poopoo them over it but sympathise, if someone is sad and going through a hard time regardless of what I think they need support and thats what I give them, I have no right to judge someone elses pain or trauma or even criticise it in comparison to anyone elses (everyones situation is relative to them at the time because thats all they know at the time and their only point of experience at the time), if I do I better take a close look at where this attitude is coming from and have the guts to admit I have an issue drop the pride and face it and deal with it…..Im sorry that people have pain that was never helped and they were never nurtured and loved through it 😥 but that should make one all the more determined not to do the same to anyone else but be more understanding 8) …..These are just my thoughts and by no means a personal attack…….ok? 😉

The way I see it anyhow is this, there is no us and them, its hard for anyone to come out in any situation because everyone loses out in some way or another either for a season or for good sadly sometimes. We are all in the same boat of ” coming out” just with different backgrounds but that doesnt mean we dont suffer the same, a person missing half a leg is still as compromised as a person missing a whole leg and the trauma of loss and life changes is the same.

raskdog

I was never miserable about it and was happy for my friends, many of whom I was best man or groomsman for, just a sense of sadness that it would never happen for me. Always the groomsman, never the groom.

very cute 😆 I understand what you mean.

You have made some good points above, I like the one about the freezing water, how true is that, you dont know what you are in until someone brings your attention to it 😯 I guess unless a person has just been living in denial, which we do for various reasons and sometimes is quite a protective thing until we are ready to face things without falling completely apart. And yes, being with a partner certainly has a deeper level of intimacy which I think we all crave for but as women I think we are able to be quite intimate with each other without going as far as sex or kissing, Ive been there with some Christian friends and seen some that way too, many actually, even the rare guy LOL and we had to just about paint it in red that we werent an item. 😆

Where is God in the church? Good question, have found many churches myself where I sit and wonder but have found some, where yes it was rich with his presence. You are right, it is hard to maintain a r’ship with God completely on your own, you can believe on your own alright but conversing daily and worship is the hardy to do and maintain.

The church I go to when I can get there, dont really care what you are, they are yet to be open about some things but hopefully this 100 revs apology may change that. I worship and have prayer and its been the best so many many times, actually saved me in many ways and I have an old pastor friend who is just the most beautiful accepting man in the world, he would march with us but has back problems.

My Brother is an agnostic but acknowledges God but no Jesus as saviour so to speak. We often talk heaps about what God is doing and he speaks of God being in us and of us but in a different way to how I believe but still we have interesting conversations, he reckons how could we think we are in control in any way 😆 I dont poopoo (gotta find a better word 😆 ) other religions, many have things to offer that I ponder about and can usually find an aspect of God in it, the cults are what worry me and that I dont like.

I didnt know that some of the married gays have a chip on there shoulder, hard done by in what way?(sorry for my maybe obvious question) I do think sometimes that gay men have it harder than lesbian women, we seem to be every straight mans fantasy 😡 so we are tolerated better maybe.

Is there this maybe competitiveness between men, that for the ones who are married (you do mean straight married?) they seem to maybe hold it over the gay men that arent and practicing gay like “I have overcome something you havent, you just arent trying hard enough or youre just being a wimp” ❓ (this isnt what I think, just presenting a possible scenario)

Oh Ok……You sounded like you were venting with something behind it but wasn’t sure.

I agree its hard on everyone involved in the divorce as Anthony has stated in his book too. From what I gather it took him a while to get over it all but he eventually did as did his family. Have you suggested his book to your friend?

Ive never been married to know what a full on divorce is like but I kindve had a lesbian type divorce and it sucks but even though I was mad and lost some things I loved, I wouldnt swap it for anything I have now. I lost a business with it too. I do feel coming out for anyone is hard and pain and loses are involved in some way but the greatest would be your kids and that isnt something anyone gets over. But material stuff, you do just have to let it go, bitterness gets nobody nowhere.